196 replies to this topic

[ice_cold]

I'm done arguing. Ice_Cold has a good point. I don't have any real say in what Nightmist should be about. As it stands, it's an RTS. I'm just so frustrated, it's like squeezing water from a rock.

Maybe we should just leave Nightmist as it is - a game where the strongest person is determined by how many characters they can log on, how well they select their macros, how efficiently they can micro-manage and on how fast their connection to the Nightmist server is.

dont think in anyway did i mean you didnt matter as a player, and im sorry if i came acrossed that way. im just trying to point out that if there was a 1 alt limit, people would still be getting massacr'd and then you wouldnt have a way around getting killed other then sitting in cities, if you didnt have higher lvl friends.

i do think the game needs a major overhaul, but a 1 alt limit isnt going to fix it.

[Bean]

All those arguements are heavily weighted on the single fact that people want to keep their power...

As said before.... power would not dissapate, It would simply be re-organized into easily managed, smaller parts.

And to your comment about people still getting "massacar'd" the only way people would be continuously forced to cower in fear at the city gates is if a clan were hunting the countryside. If a lone player was galavanting around killing anyone he COULD. He could be stopped. thats the POINT....

Gah nevermind. You wont let go of your power, you cant even see that your arguements are based on that fact... I'm tired of this.

I'm just going to donate until JLH can run a 1-alt sister server.

/me rallies all the 1-alt pro people to donate to the cause of a sister server.

[Amy]

I have read over and over each comment everyone has made here. Still my opinion remains. There are good points that have been brought up on both sides of the issue of a 1-alt limit. I vote -NO- on a 1 alt limit. I have stated my reasons already so I will not restate them, just want to clarify my vote on the issue.

Leaving the game as it is allows people to either play 1 alt, or play more than one depending on choice. Can't our energy be focused on developing the game in other ways rather than fighting over who has more crits?

This isnt about rpg, this is not about power, this is not about who can level more or who can log on more.. in my opinion, personal choice should determine how the game is played by an individual while still abiding by the rules and standards set forth by the creators and staff.

Have a great day everyone! See you in game.

~Amy

[Stotic]

Continuing to develop in this atmosphere is like still relying on Win 95 for your OS. The further we develop the bigger the hole we dig. Do you know how disturbing it is that I have to carry an alt mentality in my development stage just to compliment the current state of nightmist. Do you know how annoying it is developing in my opinion, overpowered monsters to serve the rising alt populations. (Which at the same time puts single character players at a disadvantage).

I believe a 1-"alt" rule is quite possible. Ice_cold and others, you may not see the benefits because most of the idea is purely in a construction stage. We're not just gonna change the alt count and leave it at that. There would have to be some modifications to the gameplay which can be done WITHOUT a reset. In response to Ice_Cold's boss argument about there not being enough players on to fight...well in oldmist we managed quite well in our "1-alt minded" world. And yet again stating, boss and monster attributes would be altered.

I don't believe Ice_Cold or others here are opposing because of greed or power hungriness. Every idea has its opposers. I think it's obvious that no one here is going to change anyone's mind.

By the way, I feel Havanor was just speaking out of frustration.

Good day, good ole' Stotic.

[Deval]

Just throwing in a tiny comment, (because I'm busy), on what Ice Cold said, saying that by having a crit limit makes players who aren't in a clan weaker then their colleagues. That's the whole point of a clan, you group together with other people to increase your chances, strength and ability to defend yourself. Why should one single player have the strength to annihilate an entire network of players? That's ridiculous.

[ice_cold]

Continuing to develop in this atmosphere is like still relying on Win 95 for your OS. The further we develop the bigger the hole we dig. Do you know how disturbing it is that I have to carry an alt mentality in my development stage just to compliment the current state of nightmist. Do you know how annoying it is developing in my opinion, overpowered monsters to serve the rising alt populations. (Which at the same time puts single character players at a disadvantage).

I believe a 1-"alt" rule is quite possible. Ice_cold and others, you may not see the benefits because most of the idea is purely in a construction stage. We're not just gonna change the alt count and leave it at that. There would have to be some modifications to the gameplay which can be done WITHOUT a reset. In response to Ice_Cold's boss argument about there not being enough players on to fight...well in oldmist we managed quite well in our "1-alt minded" world. And yet again stating, boss and monster attributes would be altered.

I don't believe Ice_Cold or others here are opposing because of greed or power hungriness. Every idea has its opposers. I think it's obvious that no one here is going to change anyone's mind.

By the way, I feel Havanor was just speaking out of frustration.

Good day, good ole' Stotic.

well how bout i throw out another idea that you guys havent thought of. start developing areas with alt restrictions. you can put alt restriction at any number 1,2,3,4,5,100 whatever you like. its another way to allow what some people, and what others want in the same game.

[Deval]

That idea has been suggested many times in the past, and you know who the people were who stopped it from being put it? Go on, take a guess, I dare you.

[Bean]

I can give you a hint. It wasnt staff.

[Oasis]

Taking away nightmists unlimited alt limit would totally take away nightmist's uniqueness, I mean if it was to be put in what would be the reason for people to come to nightmist rather than lets say revelation. It would be almost exactly like every other text based 1-alt limit game.

[Lich]

I didnt take the time to read the whole of this post because i have been unable to check the forum for a while so bare with me is i say something that was covered and i didnt see it.


I agree with this because of the rp Aspect. You as a person are one person. What fun is it to rp alone on 10 crits. so one crit is better because you have to rp with others and can more personalize just that one so that all those in game say ohhh there goes lich ...

I dont think the cap can be raised right now because it would put those at a disadvantage already at even more of one but that is just me.

rereads ok i think that is it

[dognapot]

Taking away nightmists unlimited alt limit would totally take away nightmist's uniqueness, I mean if it was to be put in what would be the reason for people to come to nightmist rather than lets say revelation. It would be almost exactly like every other text based 1-alt limit game.

i don't think that's what makes nightmist unique... well you know what, maybe it does. nightmist doesn't charge us to use alts. i always thought what made nightmist unique was how it hasn't become a stagnant wasteland noobs running the game in the absence of a developer, like children running a house in absence of thier parents. all applying thier beliefs of what the developer wants towards how someone else is behaving, and sycophantically praising staff wherever it can be seen, posting guides on appeasing our gods, and enforcing the meaningless mores listed in the guides.

[Bean]

Nightmist is perfectly unique without alts... that argument is ridiculous.

I went and checked out this revelation all you people keep ranting about.... Its more of a text based EVERQUEST than anything... Its hardly like nightmist at all, besides the fact its text based.

[Autek]

They just keep throwing out resons that there should be more than 1 alt, but everything they say keeps getting shot down lol.

[Oasis]

All 'they' have is for freaking roleplaying. NO-ONE (exeption of 1-2 people maybe)roleplays ingame anyway, what will 1 alt do. Nothing.

This ranting about roleplaying is pointless, nightmist is hopeless when it comes to roleplaying, go to sgh do you see any RP? No. Its like sup bro, nm jus chillin, g2g.

[Bean]

The last like 40 posts on this topic have had little to do with roleplaying...

At least for the most part.

There are stronger reasons for a pro- 1 alt game than just RPing. If you re-read all those posts im sure you'll see that.

ESPECIALLY dognapots, devals, and havanors posts. They hardly mention roleplaying.

No wonder you cant see where we are coming from, you are not even absorbing our arguements.

[Thunderja]

Continuing to develop in this atmosphere is like still relying on Win 95 for your OS.  The further we develop the bigger the hole we dig.  Do you know how disturbing it is that I have to carry an alt mentality in my development stage just to compliment the current state of nightmist.  Do you know how annoying it is developing in my opinion, overpowered monsters to serve the rising alt populations. (Which at the same time puts single character players at a disadvantage). 

I believe a 1-"alt" rule is quite possible.  Ice_cold and others, you may not see the benefits because most of the idea is purely in a construction stage.  We're not just gonna change the alt count and leave it at that.  There would have to be some modifications to the gameplay which can be done WITHOUT a reset.  In response to Ice_Cold's boss argument about there not being enough players on to fight...well in oldmist we managed quite well in our "1-alt minded" world.  And yet again stating, boss and monster attributes would be altered. 

I don't believe Ice_Cold or others here are opposing because of greed or power hungriness.  Every idea has its opposers.  I think it's obvious that no one here is going to change anyone's mind.

By the way, I feel Havanor was just speaking out of frustration. 

                                                        Good day, good ole' Stotic.

well how bout i throw out another idea that you guys havent thought of. start developing areas with alt restrictions. you can put alt restriction at any number 1,2,3,4,5,100 whatever you like. its another way to allow what some people, and what others want in the same game.

This idea may not be a perfect solution, but it may be a good enough idea to keep the 1 alt players and us evil alt users happy, altho it would mean alot of work for JLH and other staff.

I know it isn't perfect as it does not really address all the issues and arguments that have been posted on this thread, but it would be a good starting point.

Before I put forward all my crazy one alt area ideas i shall wait and see how this is received ie:Temporary solution to a long term problem. I already know this has been discussed before but this particular thread seems to be getting some valid points unlike others.

[Bean]

I have an idea, lets all just admit we've reached a stalemate in ideas.

Lets let JLH sort it out, give us his opinion. And go from there.

[Oasis]

Hrm JLH;
Tons of work and effort/time putting forth to recreate nightmist

OR

Just try to keep things going as is.

[Wolfgang]

I'm done arguing. Ice_Cold has a good point. I don't have any real say in what Nightmist should be about. As it stands, it's an RTS. I'm just so frustrated, it's like squeezing water from a rock.

Maybe we should just leave Nightmist as it is - a game where the strongest person is determined by how many characters they can log on, how well they select their macros, how efficiently they can micro-manage and on how fast their connection to the Nightmist server is.

... i dont think anyone was saying that...

I think you have a say. Your posts are clear, concise, and intelligable. In that way, you have more of a say than most players.

I havent been able to read anything since my last post, due to the fact that i have been out of town all weekend, and have been unable to access a computer.

And yes, i believe that Havanor said what he said out of frustration, but I still think that it is best to keep a cool head.

[An Eskimo]

As much as we would all love an alt limit, it isn't gonna happen. I talked to JLH about this on MSN and he said he had other plans for Nightmist that will supposedly be real big.

But i'm still gonna go on about having one =P

I think that the main reason all of you people oppose this idea, is because YOU CAN'T SURVIVE without your 15 archies online.

I also don't think using alts is fair to people with nutsty ass computers/internet connection like me. I can handle a MAX of 5 alts, but I get DCed all the time, in which the people with good computer/internet connects can pk me while i'm laggin out.

But still, I would like to see some of you people opposing this idea survive with an alt limit. Nightmist should be about skill, not how many damn alts you can load.

[Bean]

The reason JLH doesnt give a straight yes or no answer ingame/on messenger is because HE CANT.

If he were to say yes or no, and then have a change of heart, every player in the game would take part in calling him a hypocrit or some other less.... flattering names. Maybe these big plans he has will pave the way for a 1-alt nightmist. or PERHAPS It will go the other way. We as players cannot know.

Asking questions to JLH about whats in development is NOT going to get you a direct, or even remotely reliable answer. Because plain and simple they dont want you to know until its in... Otherwise people complain about things taking too long, etc etc.

P.S: This is not a direct dig at you An Eskimo, I just thought I would say it.... No hard feelings.

[dognapot]

actually jlh is just amazingly adept at being vague, but short and to the point at the same time. atleast with game matters. other things i don't know about. it's a true talent. he'd make an infuriatingly good spokesperson.

secondly, i wouldn't go so far as to say that people opposing a 1-alt nightmist simply can't survive without alts. they'd just rather keep them, and either enjoy nightmist now, or fear losing power (in the future, or just the power they have now). surviving in a 1-alt nightmist would be incredibly easy, i mean, hell, you could play it with one crit. until you can start using fractions of characters, i can't see it becoming any easier.

[ice_cold]

I think that the main reason all of you people oppose this idea, is because YOU CAN'T SURVIVE without your 15 archies online.

I also don't think using alts is fair to people with nutsty ass computers/internet connection like me. I can handle a MAX of 5 alts, but I get DCed all the time, in which the people with good computer/internet connects can pk me while i'm laggin out.

1) I don't have any arches, sold them all, highest crit now is lvl 27 which is a Pacifist...

2) My computer can't log more then 5 crits, I run windows 98 on a stick of 64 ram using wal mart connect, yes, wal mart dial up service

3) I have yet to see a valid reason from you, other then the fact you use 1 alt, to go to a 1 alt limit.



Now people, every single one of you are just as selfish as the people your saying are only trying to keep the game they want it. You say to them, well you want it to be like that because of your alts, it would be better because you wouldnt be pk'd as easy, you would have to rely on other people for help causing less problems. where as we say, you just want 1 alt because thats what you like, would make clans a must, would cause more bickering or force people to play together when they dont want to. Just admit that you want what YOU want, not neccessarily whats best for the game, you may think its for the best, but i can say all though im decently known, i dont go train with people, period, i just dont like it. How is me not wanting to go out with someone being selfish? im a shy person, i just dont like it. People with alts dont look at it from your prospective and you dont look at it from ours. I've tried, I've tried to look at it from yours, I've tried making suggestions, yet you guys keep going back to 1 ALT FOR ALL. You JUST want what YOU want. I really don't believe you have every single person in mind. Me and Squee have both posted 1 Alt classes that I believe we both think could lessen the alt strain on the game, yet I have seen very few of you actually post on it who are objected to people using alts. Why don't you guys give these classes a try, atleast look over the topics (lycanthrope, General & Hunter {also has Knights}, and Shaman {page 3 has final revision}) and post why you think they wouldn't work. I mean come on, atleast we're trying right?

Edited by ice_cold, 05 April 2004 - 12:45 PM.

[dognapot]

it's different from that. a 1-alt nightmist is just an inevitability, because nightmist can't grow from here very well. i've said it before in another post but alts stand in the way of character development. you can't give any class too much development in the area of skills, enhancements, or any advantages, because the tenth class (alt-parties), has the most powerfull skill in the game: stacking. so by giving any class an ability that makes it 1/4 more deadly, gives four alt party the ability to be twice as deadly, or to put it in a more amusing way, 200% more deadly. so when any system that alters PvP or even PvNPC interactions is put up, it's usually put back down (as it should be) because even the smallest advantage can grossly exploited in nightmist. hell, we got nothin' better to do. for example, we get the 'temporary' 10 level pk restriction, because our poor noobs are crying themselves to sleep every night "why AnArChY? why!?", but how many noobs does it save? hell idunno, they can't spell or make complete sentences, but i do know the rest of us who can think started lead our parties with invisible mages that can't be hit by archmasters. i know the journeyman berserker is a really fun crit to waste noobs with. i know those non-pkable noob crits make great change purses. i know adept crits make wonderfull bait to bring out master and archmaster crits to slaughter. like i said, really small things, but should they really be there?

[JLH]

bean, nice post

[Silverwizard]

We have a JLH comment which to me only seems to show us, he is looking, but does not feel like telling us anything, but I would have to say that in the area that he says something along the lines of "Nightmist as you know it will never be one alt" causes a hamper to us, why not just suggest 10000000000000000000000000000000's of 1 alt classes therefore causing at least one or two to get into the game.

(I did not use a quote simply because I really did not feel like getting out exactly what he said).

[Charon]

(I did not use a quote simply because I really did not feel like getting out exactly what he said).

That was, pretty much, exactly what he said ^^

nightmist (as you know it) will never be 1-alt

I just find it a shame that I don't dare chip in on any of the other comments on this thread... I'm a coward at heart and you're all so hostile to each other :s

I get the feeling that even if I were to post my balanced 'agreeing but objective' style of arguements, both sides would find some heavy weaponry and I'd be in the firing line ^^

Edited by Charon, 05 April 2004 - 09:02 PM.

[Silverwizard]

Charon, go ahead, if you get in a cross fire, back off, if not, then your good.

((Also, my memory strikes agian w00t w00t))

[Gaddy]

I wouldn't say nightmist will never be 1 alt limit, seems like pandi is rather fond of it. It would, however, take so much programming and re-coding and stuff that they do, that they would basically be better off just scrapping all of current nightmist and starting over, which JLH said a reset is not happening...so -shrug- if 1 alt came in i don't know what i'd do with all of my crits...so i don't really see what jlh and pandi would do to make a 1 alt thing unless they just allowed it to be an option and 1 alt crits were made very strong so as to make up for the fact that they're not able to have multiple of themselves on.

[Amy]

All 'they' have is for freaking roleplaying. NO-ONE (exeption of 1-2 people maybe)roleplays ingame anyway, what will 1 alt do. Nothing.

This ranting about roleplaying is pointless, nightmist is hopeless when it comes to roleplaying, go to sgh do you see any RP? No. Its like sup bro, nm jus chillin, g2g.

How come everyone says that people only want the 1 alt ultimatum because of roleplaying? I roleplay pretty much consistently in game, have tons of alts, and I personally do NOT agree with the 1 alt limit. I like the fact that having additional alts lets you explore more of the game with or without others, and is mostly a matter of choice, has nothing to do with power, rp, nor even leveling others faster.

~Good day,
Amy of Draco