52 replies to this topic

[Rappy_Ninja]

Therefore the if

And I do mean if he actually beats you, not if he was to make up logs saying he did, like some people do in the clan forums.

actually I dont edit the logs only what they say to make them seem more dumb but this is neither here nor there so go back on topic or be quiet

also when was the last warpost I made ?

Edited by Rappy_Ninja, 06 July 2004 - 04:55 PM.

[Stigmata]

Agreed.

I don't think it's suitable to bring up that topic on this thread. Unless your intent on starting an argument?

[Angelus]

I find it most unfair that players can buy their way to power using currency that is not related to the game in anyway to gain items for it.

It's the reason why you can't trade stuff for outside items on another game, and its the same reason why you cant buy stuff with real money. You wan't something bad enough, you earn it like everyone else. Or you get lucky like me.

Almost every rich player has gotten stuff from people who quit, half of TR is from players who left and gave them their stuff, so earning my ass lol

[Stigmata]

Earning the respect of a player enough so that they give you their stuff.

Different type of earning, but earning all the same.


Also - The difference with receiving crits is that EVERYONE in game has the chance to gain some free stuff from other players. There is no advantage to having real life money in this case, and not one single person will be benefited by outside means when it comes to getting free stuff.

Edited by Stigmata, 06 July 2004 - 05:05 PM.

[Eamon]

[quote name='Rappy_Ninja' date='Jul 6 2004, 05:47 PM']

/t tadpole if you got beat in the proficiency tournament by someone that bought their crits and items with RL money, would you be upset? [/QUOTE]

it wouldent happen [/quote]
Who seems intent on starting another argument here?
I was staying on topic in asking Chris a question.
Someone else went off topic.

[Eamon]

I need to learn how to quote.

I said the thing to Chris, He replied with
"It wouldnt happen"

[Stigmata]

Regardless of who started it, it would be a shame to see another perfectly interesting and acceptable thread turn into another locked topic.

[Squee]

I've read the arguments and I truly believe selling Custom Pics obtained through donations is basically buying more gold/crits/items with real life money.

However...I don't think I see any solid solution to it...unless you just want to get rid of all the custom pics (which I doubt).

[Oracle]

I've read the arguments and I truly believe selling Custom Pics obtained through donations is basically buying more gold/crits/items with real life money.

However...I don't think I see any solid solution to it...unless you just want to get rid of all the custom pics (which I doubt).

Mine and JLH's view exactly.

[Angelus]

I say burn the custom pic on the name, then JLh won't have to keep updating his list with new names and scrape old names. And staff won't have to do the custom pics trades anymore, they will still be traded probably, but not being able to change ur name brings price down and makes it not worth it anymore.

[Eamon]

Or, you could also make it so that a custom pic could be transfered to a different crit in your account, but a crit with a custom pic can not change accounts.

[ice_cold]

And /t tadpole

If someone were to buy 2 cutsom pics, and sell them off for 1.some odd mil, which is what bids look like on the forums in items for sale, they make more than 2 mil gold for 70 bucks. If they were to do this multiple times, say, buy 4 custom pics a month and sell them all off, eventually, the amount of gold this all adds up to adds up.

Now, say someone starts doing this, buys arch crits, and equips to wear on the crits he buys, and owns you in the Prof Tournament. Think people will start complaining then?

try 60 american dollars for 1 pic. anyone who donated 60 dollars for a quick 1 mil in gold, has something wrong with them. like i said before, i have 2 mains, mr pirate and lexavier, i log on lexavier once every 3-4 days. besides that, you will rarely ever see me logging on a crit, why should i donate and just give away my pics? at the same time, why should i donate and get nothing for it when multiple people after me will donate and get custom pictures.

there's a LARGE difference going on here, between spending rlm on items out of game, we're giving money to the server, rather then paying 100$ *remember when people wqere spending 100$ on cobalts?* to some 14 year old with no life. you look at that, 10 million gold for 100, compared to what people are getting for thier custom pics, 60$ for 1 mil in gold.

in all honesty, i quit a good ammount of time ago, sitting at sgh role playing *very very unoccasionally rescently* and because of the large player abuse i recieve for trying to have fun, i was going to design a clan house so me and some friends can roleplay. maybe it was wrong for me to try and make an enviroment more suitable for non-pk'ers and that may unbalance the game.

[Gaddy]

I still don't see it being a problem, people aren't going to keep buying custom pics like they keep buying SGs and AoHs. Do you really think anyone is going to think "Hey, I want custom pics for all of my characters!" I really think everyone would think it takes away from their main with the custom.

I doubt I'd ever give anything in Nightmist for a custom pic, I like the choosable ones. Only way I see as very likely for me to get one would be to donate, simply because I've played so long that I ought to owe JLH and Pandi, el oh el.

They're not a long term problem, eventually people who want custom pics and would trade things for them will run out. Unlike how with items in game, everyone wants more for more crits, customs are kind of a 1 main type of thing, or I don't see people trying to get multiple ones.


In all truth and honesty, for all I care, JLH could sell people Cobalts and what not for real money just to help pay for his expenses. I would never buy any, and I would think it was funny if someone did, reasonable for some people, but dumb to me. How strong do you think a player really gets by getting a cobalt or 2? Maybe if they trade for some good archs...still though, in the end, it is very unlikely to do anything to MY Nightmist account...

It's not real life, and it doesn't matter if people are more 'powerful'. I am not saying "cause they still don't have skill". You are playing a text based game, you click pictures and hit macros. 'Skill' is a very poor word to refer to simply knowing what to do...skills like, being able to hit a free kick in soccer or something, not clicking a button or box with your mouse. I am simply saying, it really doesn't matter if someone's got more crits and items than you because at the end of the day, you're still not hurt by it, you simlpy aren't some superpower in a game -twirls finger-

[Stigmata]

The simplist way to put it that I can think of is this -

Selling a custom picture gives you an unfair advantage over everyone else because you earnt that item via outside means.

If you went for a job interview and didn't get the job because someone else had the money available to bribe the interviewer you wouldn't be very happy.

I like the fact that to get anywhere in this game you have to do it yourself, you can't buy your way to the top and that's how it should stay.



On the flip side, it's only a picture, but it's still an advantage over someone else because of that players funds outside the game.

[Oracle]

I agree completely but I don't know how the game can be kept completely to such a policy.

[Stigmata]

I can't see it being that hard to enforce wes to be honest.

For one only certain staff (maybe only jlh and pan nowadays) can alter pictures.

That puts a stop to people trying to sell just a picture.

Secondly, if you simply stated it was against the rules with a punishable offence (like trading for outside items) then people wouldn't do it. Because it's something so obvious like a picture, if anyone were to buy a crit with a custom on (obviously having to pay more for the pic than the crits value) then it would be spotted immediately by someone.

I'm not bothered to be honest, and I wouldn't take any notice - but i'm pretty sure that there are a few players out there who agree with the against selling argument that would inform staff if it were to occur.

It is a small issue, but it's something that I feel should be disallowed, purely because it's unfair to the majority of players (who are young children) that cannot afford to donate to nightmist, receive a reward and then sell it off for item/crits or whatever.

Nightmist is one of the rare online games i've seen where you download it, start playing and have to work your way up the hard way, without being able to look on the net and buy some equipment using outside money.

Nightmist is nightmist, so gold should be it's currency, not pounds and dollars.



Edit : Just thought

Some of you mentioned that 1mil isn't really that much gold, and selling a picture won't get you that much of an advantage, which is true if you happen to be an established player already.

What if I were a first time player, logged on, noticed people selling pictures and decided to donate to get one myself?

Would that be fair to the other new players? 1mil gold is a hell of alot to people just starting out, and although the advantage may be small once the crit levels up, it is still a huge advantage none the less compared to the other newbies around.

Edited by Stigmata, 07 July 2004 - 01:27 PM.

[Iron_Maiden]

I dunno there must be away round it... like when you set macros on crits they dont transfer along with the crit to another account on someone elses computer do they, they stay on yours. Then if you decied to sell the crit that has the custom pic then will have to be moved to another crit of yours... So say what you like i dont think they should be able to be sold...

[Stigmata]

Macros don't move because they are computer specific........meaning they are only located on your pc and not on the server, but the server will check them from your nightmist folder (I believe).

If pic's worked in the same way it'd allow the players to manipulate/change their picture whenever they desired, and could also mean that anyone without a custom picture could just add one to the folder.

nice idea though.

[Oracle]

I can't see it being that hard to enforce wes to be honest.

For one only certain staff (maybe only jlh and pan nowadays) can alter pictures.

That puts a stop to people trying to sell just a picture.

Secondly, if you simply stated it was against the rules with a punishable offence (like trading for outside items) then people wouldn't do it. Because it's something so obvious like a picture, if anyone were to buy a crit with a custom on (obviously having to pay more for the pic than the crits value) then it would be spotted immediately by someone.

I'm not bothered to be honest, and I wouldn't take any notice - but i'm pretty sure that there are a few players out there who agree with the against selling argument that would inform staff if it were to occur.

It is a small issue, but it's something that I feel should be disallowed, purely because it's unfair to the majority of players (who are young children) that cannot afford to donate to nightmist, receive a reward and then sell it off for item/crits or whatever.

Nightmist is one of the rare online games i've seen where you download it, start playing and have to work your way up the hard way, without being able to look on the net and buy some equipment using outside money.

Nightmist is nightmist, so gold should be it's currency, not pounds and dollars.



Edit : Just thought

Some of you mentioned that 1mil isn't really that much gold, and selling a picture won't get you that much of an advantage, which is true if you happen to be an established player already.

What if I were a first time player, logged on, noticed people selling pictures and decided to donate to get one myself?

Would that be fair to the other new players? 1mil gold is a hell of alot to people just starting out, and although the advantage may be small once the crit levels up, it is still a huge advantage none the less compared to the other newbies around.

I would be happy with enforcing this but obviously it is up to JLH.

[Angelus]

JLH knows you can't stop it.

I can put my pic on anything i want, i can put it on your crit if i wanted too. That's allowed.

I can give 1 mill to someone just like that. That's allowed.

So how will you stop me from giving someone my pic and getting something in return?

[Squee]

Gaddy, are you suggesting one of those "sweep it under the rug" solutions? That may work but, obviously, it's risky.

[Gaddy]

Sweep it under the rug? How so?

I guess if you mean, ignore it because it's really not a big deal and it's not going to actually end up causing problems, then ya...that's basically what I think.

Also---I see what you mean about new players Ste, I just really don't see any likelyness of it actually happening. Muchless if it happens 1 or 2 times, what difference does it make? Some noob will have an arch or an AoH...quit, sell it and give it to someone or donate it to some clan that the maker is just trying to make gold off of selling...


I guess my problem lies in not really caring if people get things in Nightmist. I think you should work on your own stuff. I don't see any reason to spend money on Nightmist to get things. I only see donating to Nightmist for the fact that JLH and Pandi hold it up for us for free as a reason to spend any money on it. I'd really like to donate to Nightmist, it's just that, like you said, I am 16. I haven't got any money in the first place, and what I do have gets leeched off me by gas, my friends, and my girlfriend. If I were to donate, I wouldn't want a pic, I'd ask them to change Cky to CKY...Ryan says money has to be donated for that, he can't trade his pic for it. Don't know that he's even got the name Cky atm anyway though.


Anyway, I understand what you guys mean, and agree- people shouldn't spend money to get stuff in Nightmist. I just couldn't care less if they do cause it doesn't do anything to me. Then even if it does something in game...I can turn my computer off if it's really THAT big of a deal. Muchless, o no, a person got 2m from spending 60-100 dollars on Nightmist...
Look at some stuff that people give to their friends, their friends didn't earn it or anything, were just friends.
Did I earn having Archie give me Prism? Or newb giving me his stuff when he quit (that I eventually got back to him when he came back)? Or did I just get them?
I didn't work for them, being friends with the guys gave me an unfair advantage. Just look at what Archie restored to give to his friend--the best items in Nightmist and a few 6/6s, a couple of cobalts, is it an unfair advantage to have played for a long ass time and have friends who'll give you stuff? No, we didn't cheat, we just played a while and people became our friends, our friends left and didn't want to delete the stuff they worked for, so they gave it to people who made Nightmist more enjoyable for them.

Then how is it an unfair advantage to be an ambitous noob who can't make gold like old players so he spends actual money funding some of Nightmist. I'd personally love to see JLH get a grand or two every month to help fund Nightmist. The faster the server runs, the less lag I get, the more I can do.
So how does it matter if some noob spends 100 dollars on Nightmist to get 2m, I mean...do you think anyone can really even do it? People aren't going to keep giving 1m for pics.

I am so sorry for all of these long posts, I'll try to start posting like JLH with just sentences except when I suggest modifications of some kind....wow I ramble.

Edited by Gaddy, 07 July 2004 - 04:07 PM.

[Iron_Maiden]

Macros don't move because they are computer specific........meaning they are only located on your pc and not on the server, but the server will check them from your nightmist folder (I believe).

If pic's worked in the same way it'd allow the players to manipulate/change their picture whenever they desired, and could also mean that anyone without a custom picture could just add one to the folder.

nice idea though.

Then maybe a extra option is added on the top tool bar for only those who have donated and have the rights for a custom pic...

Edited by Iron_Maiden, 07 July 2004 - 04:08 PM.