104 replies to this topic

[Deval]

The minions of a necromancer have no soul, they are animated by the necromancer life force, thats it. That's all. Nothing more. Nadda. That being said, is why the undead minions will, unquestioningly do his bidding. HOWEVER, a necromancer has no interest in animating mundane creatures e.g a golem. For example 'a golem' he would have to craft the creature, which is not a necromancers cup of tea. Creatres can be stitched together, or simply animated back to 'unlife' as a corpse exists. He is only interested in the dead, and the undead.

[Bean]

A summoner would be more likely to be working with golems, or elementals warders as it were.

[green_mantis]

So far there are four people who don't want golems, and two who don't want teeth.

So it seems that Golems need the defending.

Golems are unliving and unintelligent servants of a necromancer. They are not living so could be mastered by both unlife and life energies. I have not seen any other Necromancer topic that included a golem, so I'm not sure what you mean by cliche Squee.
Also, a Necromancer, being a master of life or unlife doesn't seem to matter to me. I find that I provided a suitable alternative to being forced into being an evil character. Though some Necromancers would be evil a lot might not be evil. Also, on the note of crafting the Golems: The necromancer guild in that city would hire people to craft the bodies so that the necromancers could buy pre-made husks, ready for their direction.
The only golem you do not have to buy is the Homunculis, which is made from a batch of the necromancer's flesh.

Edited by green_mantis, 29 April 2004 - 12:06 PM.

[Tatsu]

i think the main reason people are complaining about them is cos golem is used in so many RPGs, it would be nice to have somthing else in nightmist....just change the name or summing.

i dont see why they need golems anyway, just keep it as skeletons (did you get that idea from mir btw?)

but it would be nice if they had a bit of variation on what they summon, such as zombies, ghouls, skeletons, swarms of bats and the like.

but anyway gw and gl with the idea

[green_mantis]

No, I didn't get the idea of skeles from mir (dont know what it is)

I also believe that too much variation in the summons would make the others seem less special and may become just an ordinary thing.

[Opie]

/me slaps tatsu

Why would you think he got the idea for skeletons from any game? Necromancers have had skeletons scince they were first played in D&D.

And you know what? Necromancers are all about messin with things. They would animate a chair if they thought it would be funny (how do you think sarka got em? )

p.s I know I know, who cares about D&D this is nightmist. But like i've said a million times, MUD: Multi-User Dungeon But i feel like a geek justmentioning D&D all the time. Do i sound like one? What do you think Deval? open shot, once in a lifetime opportunity.

Edited by Opie, 01 May 2004 - 07:58 AM.

[Deval]

If I insulted you for being a geek, It'd make me a hypocrite.

[Opie]

If I insulted you for being a geek, It'd make me a hypocrite.

Rofl, fair enough. fair enough. I hate posting just to say that, but... yeah, that's all i got

[Squee]

A lot of Necromancer threads include golems, be they Iron Golems/Maidens or Blood/Flesh golems. I see that and just want to groan out.

I like to see new things and new interpretations of classes; that's what makes it appealing.

[busta_newb]

howdy doody, maybe there could be some summoned poopy?


oooo beware of of the stench of the stinky poopy!!!!!





/me pokes everyone

[Silverwizard]

Well Mantis I think I pretty well spelled out all I had about energy drain, it was just a cool thing instead of putting already used shock there, just a little spice nothing else.

Golems are human's attempt at creating life, nothing more. In jewish mythology they were clay statues which the priets using the power of God animated. They would put Emeth (truth) on their forehead during the day to make it active to serve them and erase the E making it Meth (death) at night to make it inactive, always in the myth the priest would forget to erase the E and the golem would be possessed by an evil spirit, and here comes Mr. Necromancer if ya want decent reason for the golems.

The other famous golem is a household word but nobody knows it is a golem almost. This is Frankenstien's monster. It is corpses stiched together to create a monsterous human with life but nary an emotion nor soul, and that sounds like something Mr. Necromancer would make himself.

[Bean]

How about Daemons instead of golems...

Daemons *Or demons... I guess* could have all the same stats as golems, and would suit the theme of necromancer.

Anyone?

[Silverwizard]

Demons acctually suit the class less than the golem buuuuuuuuuuuut, they were not used in Diablo (I think) and people seem obsessed with the fact that Diablo acctually uses common fantasy things that anyone who knows a little fantasy could think of and that if we use any of them we or horrendous copy-cats and the skum of the earth so the demon might get a better reception.

[Squee]

God forbid you think up something new for a class.

You don't have to use golems. You could call them puppets or manikins or marionettes or figurines, just as examples.

[Bean]

Or demons.

Silverwizard. Im seeing a lot of non-constructive posts by you round the forum. Need you be such an asshole to everyone around you simply because they do not see your way?

Change is the future my friend, and NOTHING says that golems have to be used for necromancers, or that demons have to be used as necromancers. It was an idea, I was throwing it out in the open. I expected both kinds of comments, negative and positive, but I expected them to be constructive as well. Seeing as this.

And the golems being used for necromancers has nothing to do with diablo... they werent the first people to do it *And god forbid they wont be the last either...* But having other options for the necromancer class is very refreshing.

Seeing the EXACT same classes with the EXACT same abilities in every game is NOT how games will advance... So please, PLEASE, try to be more constructive next time eh?

On topic- I think demons would fit necromancers nicely for nightmist. It stays with the necromancer theme, without disagreeing with anything everyone here has said in opposition to golems.

[green_mantis]

Having Demons would make Necromancers incredbly evil.
First, they would have to be massively powerful to subdue the demon.
Second, they would have to bend a demon to their will, which is a very evil and difficult thing to do.
Lastly, they would never actually be able to control a demon, as the Demon has infinitely more power than an everyday necromancer.

Silverwizard: If you want me to put in that spell, you have to do the work for it. Write a description similar to what I have.

So far I have made one change to see how it looks:


Summons: Necromancers, because of their training in magic, are naturally weak. So they create powerful allies for combat. All of a Necromancer's summons will attack his/her enemies, as well as anyone who attacks either of them. All summons earn exp for their master (Only 1/2 normal exp though.).

Animate Puppet: Mana cost:25 + 25 Health
Requirements: Level:1, Cost: 5000 gold.
Command: /cast animate puppet/[target]
When the right materials are present, a Necromancer can create a powerful servant to have fight along side him/her.
Effect: creates one of the following Golems out of the materials listed:

Puppets: Each of the following puppets has stats based on the Necromancer's. Puppets automatically attack caster's enemies. Costs labeled are costs for the body. Any Necromancer may only have one Puppet at a time. Puppets attacks should be treated as fighter attacks for their level and stats.

Homunculis:
Required level:1
Cost: 25HP (Created from the Necromancer's own flesh)
This small, almost human-looking creature is fairly weak and not very good in a fight.
HP:75, Str:75%, Dex:100%, Armor:4, Base damage:2 (Sharp teeth.), attacks once every 10 secs.

Clay puppet:
Required level:5
Cost: 1000 gold (Must buy body and animate it at Necromancer's guild.)
This Puppet is carved out of clay, harvested near the city of Nightmist.
HP:125%, Str:100%, Dex:80%, Armor:8, Base damage:5 (Club-like fist.), Attacks once every 7 secs.

Stone Puppet:
Required level:10
Cost: 2000 gold (Must buy body and animate it at Necromancer's guild.)
This Puppet is crafted from granite, making it extremely tough.
HP:150%, Str:125%, Dex:70%, Armor:16, Base damage:10, (Hammer fists.), Attacks once every 7 secs.

Iron Puppet:
Required level:15
Cost: 4000 gold (Must buy body and animate it at Necromancer's guild.)
This Puppet is made from high-quality iron. One of its arms holds a large broad sword.
HP:175%, Str:125%, Dex:85%, Armor:32, Base damage:17, (Large Broad sword.), Attacks once every 6 secs.

Guardian Puppet:
Required level:20
Cost: 8000 gold (Must buy body and animate it at Necromancer's guild.)
This Puppet is made from a combination of wood, stone , and iron. It carries a huge longsword in its hands.
HP:200%, Str: 150%, Dex:100%, Armor:50, Base damage:23, (Huge Longsword), Attacks once every 5 secs.

It looks okay and they are not called Golems, even though that is still what they are.

[Bean]

Ugh, you people dont get it do you?

You are NOT basing your creation of ANYTHING in nightmist on real world myths or facts. Because Nightmist is NOT the real world, Therefore, demons are very much possible for necromancers. And I hardly see how enslaving demons to do your bidding is evil... If anything that could be seen as the opposite. now enslaving angels to do your bidding... thats evil.

[menardi]

I have a question If necromancers can only be played alone and when your on one you cant be on another crit then how would they heal themslves wit that life drain thing it would onlly give you 20hp back and what about the golem doesnt that need a heal?and also who would always go to the guild just to create a golem in the guild




Like your idea tho

[Bean]

I would assume the golems *Daemons, demons, puppets, whatever* Would have either increased healing rates, or have spells with which to heal themselves that would be triggered at a certain %age health.

I assume....

And the necros could heal with pots....

[Xlithan]

the only thing i'm interested in here is the summoning and new spells.

the fact is, we should have another mage-like class, and this is perfect.

however, it is a bit diablo2 like, but there's nothing wrong with that, as there is nothing like this ingame

[green_mantis]

Though Nightmist is a fantasy MUD, like all MUDs, it has its roots in the real world. Because of these roots, fantasy always has a few things that will always remain similar to the real world. So, because of this, I will not have Necromancers work with evil creatures especially ones that would have a mind of their own and not have their existance tied to the Necromancer.


To: Menardi,

Necromancers are not healers, they need pots if they want to restore large amounts of HP (like squiggle said.). You would heal the golems/puppets by casting Animate puppet/golem on them. The spell would heal them fully and would not cost the gold that it took to animate them in the first place.

Edited by green_mantis, 03 May 2004 - 11:42 AM.

[Bean]

Mantis, YOU wont have anything.

Beyond the introduction of the idea JLH calls the shots. Sorry bud...

[Silverwizard]

Energy Drain: This spell drains life from the necromancer's target causing minor damage. It is usually one of the first spells a budding necromancer uses.

That was a description.

/t Bean, People are being assholes and I am fighting it strongly that is all. Also, I was agreeing with the demons in a semi-sarcastic way, but I was agreeing and also sniping most people who are being tightassed about the fact that it is possible that two people can have the same ideas. I am sniping people who are being pissy at each other, you call them unconstructive, only because you cannot read.

[Bean]

Hypocrite.

Thats all I have to say.

[green_mantis]

This is a suggestion topic bean, suggest something about the topic.

Also, maybe you should look into some anger management. There seems to be a problem in that area of your personality. Other than that you seem alright though.

[Bean]

Yes, because I am disagreeing with your idea I MUST be getting mad right?

Like I said, Demons/Daemons Fit a necroish theme, and they get rid of all the arguements against golems. They FIT more than anything else is what im trying to say. Or rather, they are disagreeable to LESS people *Yourself being the only one who has spoken up.*

Actually I would want, personally A bone drake, or a bone drakeling. Just because I like dragon tamers though.

Why not do THIS, instead of having a golem spell per se, have a GREATER summoning spell that summons a monster you choose when you start *Kinda like /morphset*

You could choose from like:

Golems
Demons
Skeletal mages
Bone drakes/drakeling
Skeletal paladin.
etc

Does that sound like a more worthwhile solution than a simple, you can summon only this type thing. This way, you could still buy a body of sorts (A crystal to amplify your summoning) And the more costly the reagent is, the stronger the summon.

How bout that?

[green_mantis]

That sounds a lot better than just having one type of summon. Though I think I would only want to use: Golems, minor demons, and juvenile black dragons. Someone could choose from between those three types maybe and the summon would get stronger as they lv?

I like this idea bean. When I have more time I will try to work it in.

[Silverwizard]

Bean, you just do not like the fact I am pointing things out that is wrong, I simply point out how you fail in areas you fight to say: People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. Learn to deal with the fact your not perfect and take critisim, everyone has a point, even the person you hate.

[Bean]

Silver, I was the one pointing out YOUR flaws, not the other way around.

Anywho, Enough of the bickering, We are destroying the topic.

[Deval]

Silverwizard you are such a hypocrite.

Meanwhile, back on topic for the thread.

Working from a completely original point of view, and put preconceptions aside, dragons could be a cool idea. However, I would imagine that a full grown adult dragon would be a beast of such awesome nature that a measly necromancer would be nothing but a miniscule annoyance to it, barely worth any notice to such a powerful and majestic being.

HOWEVER.

Dragon Hatchlings, obviously lacking the size and matured power to completely obliterate thousands of humans at whim, still possess considerable strength to make most humanoids tremble with fear. The Dragon Hatchling has an, as of yet, undeveloped will and arrogance, allowing it to be plyable to the Necromancers command due to it's curious nature, attraction to magic, and thirst for knowledge.

Whaddya think? Eh? Eh? *elbow elbow*

Edit: Obviously there would be different species of Dragon Hatchlings to match the increasing levels of the necromancer.

E.g.
Thunder Lizard Hatchling
Snow Drake Hacthling
Arctic Snake Hatchling
Lightning Dragon Hatchling
Ending with something impressive like Black Dragon Hatchling or the likes

(Note: All of those are species of Dragon (In my imagination anyway), it's just more interesting to give them labels like 'Drake' and 'Snake', as the varying forms/species of the reptillian dragon are labelled akin to similar specific reptillian archtypes.)


Edit 2: This idea is presented considering the general size of the hatchlings, however young, are still about twice as large as a full grown adult human. Just thought I should give an understanding on size.