82 replies to this topic

[Stigmata]

Today on the way to chronos myself and al were using between us 15 level 30's, now to kill that sort of a party you'd think it'd take an army, but all of our crits died within 5 seconds to 1 single mage.


Now i'll explain how this happened and you can post whether you think its a bug or not, as its not too clear.

Basically we were on a trap square in the jungle, had taken the damage from the trap and were healing our crits. Then an invisible mage, who was also protected from traps ran onto the square we were on and activated the trap again damaging our crits.

He then decided to run back and forth, reactivating the trap each time, and thus damaging our crits until they died....

Now the way I see it, this is abusing a bug - The trap damage is supposed to effect the player entering the square and not the entire square (hence why the traps sometimes miss people)

Basically it looks like the server activates the trap upon someone entering the square (regardless of who's on it) then calculates each crits chance to dodge it. This is obviously fine for people just entering the square, and works well - but for those who are still left on the square it allows people the oppurtunity to exploit what I believe to be a bug.

Comments

Edited by Stigmata, 24 June 2004 - 02:10 PM.

[Angelus]

I've been killed before like this with 14 crits, because of one allied mage. It's using the area to your advantage..no one is making you go there.

[Stigmata]

It's not using the area to an advantage, its exploiting a part of it that was intended for something else. I made the area and I can tell you now, its a bug - those traps were there for the sole purpose of slowing down progressing teams so they could not simply run through the area. I'm hoping JLH will clear this issue up, and if not atleast update that area (as it was not part of the intended design) so it doesn't happen again.

[Squee]

While Protect is cast, moving should take stamina. It won't stop mages from moving back and forth through a square but it will hinder them and discourage them from such acts.

[Xian]

That would help, but I think it should be more like.. if a new crit enters a square the crits already on it dont get hit by the trap. (Bring an army of mages, move a little at a time=same effect)

[alone]

Has happened to friends of mine also. Deffinately needs to be changed to stop spoilt kids ruining the game.

[Shane]

Now hold on, that trap is set for that square. So lets say that its poison darts that fly across the room. So someone comes along and trips the trap. Just because you were already hit with the darts the first time you shouldnt get hit with them a second even though your still standing in the room? Umm, no .... if your in the room you get hit by the darts reguardless if you were hit before or not. Just because you were hit once does not make you invulnerable to the trap if its tripped again, even if its someone else tripping it.

Now I admit that was a lame way to take someone out but you dont stand safely in a trapped room because you set off the trap yourself and took the damage.

Edited by Shane, 24 June 2004 - 04:03 PM.

[alone]

It's more down to each developer, what or what-not their traps should do, in the case, it isn't doing what was originally intended.

[Shane]

It's more down to each developer, what or what-not their traps should do, in the case, it isn't doing what was originally intended.

Ok just how do you know its "intended" effect? I think the way it currently is should be its "intended" effect. I still say that if you dont wanna get hit by the same trap move off the square.

[Xian]

He knows its intended effect because Ste posted and me and Ste made the area, so no its not its Intended effect. Also if a poisoned dart comes flying out of a wall when you enter the square youre not gonna stand in the same place are you?

[Stigmata]

He know's it's intended effect cause I just posted regarding it in this very same thread.

I see your point about the poison darts etc as it did cross my mind as well (hence the discussion) but your looking at it from a realistic perspective, which can also be used to prove my point of the argument - from a realistic perspective would a sole mage trigger enough falling tree branches by moving in and out of the square rapidly within a few seconds to fall and hit an entire party of people?

I didn't intend it to work like that, and I was unaware at the time that traps could be abused in this way - and had i known I wouldn't have added them in the first place.

[Prophet]

Look at this way.

If you have a trap to kill someone in real life and they nearly get killed by this trap when another person triggers the trap, they are going to know what the trap does, and thus steer clear of where the trap attacks. Unless of course the crits are supposed to be retarded then they would say something like this :-

"Oh look the trap had been sprung and in about 3 seconds a large wooden tree if going to fall onto the area I am sat. I could move, but I would rather die 8-)"

[Rappy_Ninja]

this happened to me also

I dont think it should be removed though its perfectly fair


but since your so great maybe you should have defended against it ?


I lasted for 15 secends at least though


also at least I didnt bword and post it on forum

Edited by Rappy_Ninja, 24 June 2004 - 04:34 PM.

[Xian]

Yeh I did and we killed them all back, so shut up if you're not gonna add anything useful.

(Giving lvl 1 fighters an ability that can kill everyone on the square is fair but not really a great idea is it.)

[Prophet]

Yeh seems fair.

It would make a mage almost unbeatable in this area. Simply running backwards and forwards. Its abusing the trap system, Unless it was intended for them to be able to kill 15 archs by simply doing e,w,e,w and so on.

Rappy, Use the "Edit" Button.

Edited by Prophet, 24 June 2004 - 04:35 PM.

[Rappy_Ninja]

Yeh seems fair.

It would make a mage almost unbeatable in this area. Simply running backwards and forwards. Its abusing the trap system, Unless it was intended for them to be able to kill 15 archs by simply doing e,w,e,w and so on.

or you could just MOVE heal up and be ready to cast vision when he comes again and kill him ?


with one pally I can keep at least 8 alts perfectly healed let alone at least 2-3 arch clerics with dr

[Prophet]

Yeh, coz everyone if readily prepared for something like this and have a whole set of macroes just encase a mage decided to run back and for. They don't have literal light speed reactions.

[Rappy_Ninja]

Yeh, coz everyone if readily prepared for something like this and have a whole set of macroes just encase a mage decided to run back and for. They don't have literal light speed reactions.

if I lasted for 15 secends alone against someone doing this

ste who is supposedly one of the best players in game and his friend should more then hold their own should they not ?

[Stigmata]

And also - here's a small explaination of the trap itself.

Basically, you've all seen the move predator i'm sure, where Arnie sets up that falling tree in the jungle thats triggered by a trip rope..............well that's what gave me the idea for the trap (description too obviously).

So a party of crits goes onto the square, someone triggers the tree branch to fall, hits the party and maybe some people avoid it........that being said, how could a mage possibly trigger the trap 6 times within 2 seconds, as that is not nearly enough time at all for the tree branch to swing back to hit the party again.


Here is a suggestion to rid us of the problem - Either a time limit on traps (can be chosen by staff) so when its been activated once, it wont activate again for a certain amount of time. And you could also have it so the traps cannot go off within 5 seconds of each other.

[Xian]

You can't just move, because eventually you'll move onto a trap square, using vines is the only way to stop it but Sleeping who killed us was there with afew mages a druid for vines and a very big party, and eventually we managed to get him with it. It needs changing, not avoiding.

[Prophet]

Ste is one of the best players ingame, yet this is still a clear abusion of the bug. What if they were not fully concentrating because of the trap and had already used all their stam on healing?

[Rappy_Ninja]

And also - here's a small explaination of the trap itself.

Basically, you've all seen the move predator i'm sure, where Arnie sets up that falling tree in the jungle thats triggered by a trip rope..............well that's what gave me the idea for the trap (description too obviously).

So a party of crits goes onto the square, someone triggers the tree branch to fall, hits the party and maybe some people avoid it........that being said, how could a mage possibly trigger the trap 6 times within 2 seconds, as that is not nearly enough time at all for the tree branch to swing back to hit the party again.


Here is a suggestion to rid us of the problem - Either a time limit on traps (can be chosen by staff) so when its been activated once, it wont activate again for a certain amount of time. And you could also have it so the traps cannot go off within 5 seconds of each other.

this seems more fair


maybe a 5 secend delay like countdown before the trap can be triggered again or same person ?

[Stigmata]

Rappy not a single player in the game could avoid it.

Imagine 15 crits, all dropping 10 mana crystals onto the floor at the same time, with 15 trap messages going off at the same time, as well as the mage running back and forth changing the picture windows (big lag out)

Then imagine all that happening 6 times within 3 seconds.

Edited by Stigmata, 24 June 2004 - 04:42 PM.

[Rappy_Ninja]

I suppose also it depends on if the guy useing the mage has a faster comp (moves back and forth prob) not takeing a stab at either of you just saying


but as I just said above there should be maybe a 3-5 secend time limit before trap can go off again to give person a fair fighting chance

on the bright side at least tk probs didnt drop bot for the guy that killed you

Edited by Rappy_Ninja, 24 June 2004 - 04:45 PM.

[Xian]

That would solve the problem, but personally I still think if you've walked into an area and a trap hit you, it doesn't matter when someone else comes in, you're not gonna get hit by the same trap.

[alone]

Thank you Stigmata and Xian..

Rappy, however good a player you profess to be, I doubt you'd be able to make it through the Jungle with a mage setting every trap multipul times.

[Rappy_Ninja]

if I knew who it was and I still had a cleric

I could still do it even now maybe

[Tom]

sorta a bug, but if u wanna be safe, every square you move some people bring a druid to cast vines. therefore the mage cant run thru u

[Crane]

sorta a bug, but if u wanna be safe, every square you move some people bring a druid to cast vines. therefore the mage cant run thru u

That's quite a sensible suggestion - it won't stop them, but it will slow them down for quite a while.

[Matt]

My opinion may mean very little, But this is a bug.

In my opinion, traps should be like they are in real life, they need time to be reset. Much like a mouse trap, someone has to reset it before it is able to be used again. Possibly add another variable to traps, how long it takes before it resets and is able to hurt more people.

Edit: Meh, Already suggested, oh well.

Edited by Matt, 24 June 2004 - 05:45 PM.