31 replies to this topic

[Deval]

This is a thread I'm bringing over from the old forum cus I believe it could work.

________________________________________________THE POST
On another thread, that I believe was due some attention:

--
on 15.02.04 at 03:44:36, Everlast wrote:give them counter on physical attacks. Not all physical attacks ofcourse, just those involving open close in physical attacks, as in not covert assassinates or bow attacks.
Allowing them to counter some monsters attacks without having to use stam would also be an idea.

--

Fair call, this could work. Counter could be introduced, where for every attack (NOTE: Attack, not skill), there is a chance that the attack is countered. Working the same way that an attacked is dodged, absorbed, fizzles etc etc. The counter would only do 1/4 of what would have been the opponents initial damage, and ignores armour. Ideally, the chance to counter would be influenced by the characters dexterity, thus mixing up fighter worth amongst the races.

E.G:
A full hit would read as follows:
Deval attacked you with his 'Blade of Time' for 60 points of damage.

An attack that is countered would read as follows:
Deval attacked you with his 'Blade of Time', but you countered the blow for 15 points of damage.

15 being 1/4 of 60, it's not a massive amount of damage, but the chance to counter would help to push fighters up out of the 'Retarded Basket'.


________________________________________________REPLY

Alone:
I like the idea.. But only normal attacks? What about uncovert assassinate? The fighter will see and hear the person coming, and so give himself a chance to counter.

What's berserk counted as? Smite? All mage spells, druids attacking from morph..? They're all skills, but may be done at close range.

Each attack type should be decided, rather than overall.

Didn't mean to sound that badly.. Tired.. Got dragged put of bed this morning I love the idea.
________________________________________________REPLY
Deval:
In my opinion, assassinate should not be included, 1/4 of an assassinate is too much damage to the thief for it to be considered, and including the round of damage that the fighter will actually do normally, I can imagine it would cause an assassin serious amount of grief, and overbalance the fighter versus the theif. I also feel this way about smite, however, it should apply to beserk and rapid fire, as they are simply an extremely fast series of attacks, with each attack doing only reasonable amounts of damage. A druid attacking from Morph is fine, it's still a regular attack, whereas mages actually do not engage in close range combat, and I feel that the counter should not apply to offensive spells cast on the fighter by said mage.
________________________________________________REPLY
Fusion:
I like it, even though I dont have any fighters anymore. Might make me wanna train one up.
________________________________________________REPLY
Detheroc:
I agree with this except one thing. You seem to have forgotten that the ranger would be using rapid fire from a long way away. How do you intend to count that? Pull out the arrow and throw it back?
________________________________________________DISCUSS.

[Mad_Dog]

I like the idea.

[Nexus]

i like the idea good job finding it from the old forum i really agree (but all classes should be able to counter not just fighters but other then that i love the idea it would add a good feel to the game knowing that when a berserker attacks u u arnt allways dead lol

[Deval]

The idea is only for fighters, they need something to exemplify their supreme ability with weaponry and close combat, at the moment, there is nothing to say 'Hey look, I'm totally more kickass with a sword than you', and also make them useful for more than just cannon fodder.

[S3it0*]

/nod deval i like the idea, i own 3 Master fighters that really dont do anything except get killed in te museum when they are only there as support for my cleric.. actually, i love this idea, its great two thumbs up d_b

[Tha_Girl]

great idea

[Mastah_Fluff]

I fully support it, I am a fighter collector and would love to take them out of their boxes more often

[Zapatak]

yea, that would be awesome since 3 of my mains are only expert fighters and i get smoked all the time.

[green_mantis]

i like the idea but im not sure about something: is it a reduced damage or is it an afterattack causing damage to the opponent as well?

[Zapatak]

[quote name='Deval' date='Feb 22 2004, 10:33 PM']This is a thread I'm bringing over from the old forum cus I believe it could work.

________________________________________________THE POST
On another thread, that I believe was due some attention:

--
on 15.02.04 at 03:44:36, Everlast wrote:give them counter on physical attacks. Not all physical attacks ofcourse, just those involving open close in physical attacks, as in not covert assassinates or bow attacks. 
Allowing them to counter some monsters attacks without having to use stam would also be an idea. 

--

Fair call, this could work. Counter could be introduced, where for every attack (NOTE: Attack, not skill), there is a chance that the attack is countered. Working the same way that an attacked is dodged, absorbed, fizzles etc etc. The counter would only do 1/4 of what would have been the opponents initial damage, and ignores armour. Ideally, the chance to counter would be influenced by the characters dexterity, thus mixing up fighter worth amongst the races.

E.G:
A full hit would read as follows:
Deval attacked you with his 'Blade of Time' for 60 points of damage.

An attack that is countered would read as follows:
Deval attacked you with his 'Blade of Time', but you countered the blow for 15 points of damage.

15 being 1/4 of 60, it's not a massive amount of damage, but the chance to counter would help to push fighters up out of the 'Retarded Basket'.


________________________________________________REPLY

Alone:
I like the idea.. But only normal attacks? What about uncovert assassinate? The fighter will see and hear the person coming, and so give himself a chance to counter.

What's berserk counted as? Smite? All mage spells, druids attacking from morph..? They're all skills, but may be done at close range.

Each attack type should be decided, rather than overall.

Didn't mean to sound that badly.. Tired.. Got dragged put of bed this morning  I love the idea.
________________________________________________REPLY
Deval:
In my opinion, assassinate should not be included, 1/4 of an assassinate is too much damage to the thief for it to be considered, and including the round of damage that the fighter will actually do normally, I can imagine it would cause an assassin serious amount of grief, and overbalance the fighter versus the theif. I also feel this way about smite, however, it should apply to beserk and rapid fire, as they are simply an extremely fast series of attacks, with each attack doing only reasonable amounts of damage. A druid attacking from Morph is fine, it's still a regular attack, whereas mages actually do not engage in close range combat, and I feel that the counter should not apply to offensive spells cast on the fighter by said mage.
________________________________________________REPLY
Fusion:
I like it, even though I dont have any fighters anymore. Might make me wanna train one up.
________________________________________________REPLY
Detheroc:
I agree with this except one thing. You seem to have forgotten that the ranger would be using rapid fire from a long way away. How do you intend to count that? Pull out the arrow and throw it back? 
________________________________________________DISCUSS.[/quote]
[QUOTE]A full hit would read as follows:
Deval attacked you with his 'Blade of Time' for 60 points of damage.

An attack that is countered would read as follows:
Deval attacked you with his 'Blade of Time', but you countered the blow for 15 points of damage.

Get it now Steve!!

It's a percentage of normal hit: like 1/4


--OMG i didn't realize unitll now how stupid i really was

Edited by Zapatak, 29 February 2004 - 03:11 AM.

[green_mantis]

maybe you should have to buy it at level 10 or so and maybe it could return about a third of the damage instead of a fourth

[Mec]

Maybe the damage should have to do with how well the counter is done...
and how well the counter is done depends on how well the fighter is trained... which is basically... the fighters.... LEVEL. And it might have to do with the fighters natural ability...

[green_mantis]

it could probably be just like a normal attack except maybe with a higher miss rate so that fighters wouldnt counter everything and become off balanced but i do strongly believe it should have to be bought at lv 10

[newb]

You don't buy abilities.

It would be neat if, in the case that stances were added, certain stances would raise or lower your counter-attack %

[Deval]

'Buying' the ability is out of the question and non-sensicle. The objective of the idea is to bolster the usefulness of Fighters without complicating their divine simplicity. As for it being affected by level, 1/4 of any damage from any class is not a remarkable figure, including the fact that there is only a chance it may counter anyway, which as I said, would be dictated by the Fighter and the opponents dexterity.

[green_mantis]

why couldnt you buy an ability? wouldnt it be the same as buying a spell?

buying an ability would be like paying for a guildmaster to teach you the ability

Edited by green_mantis, 29 February 2004 - 11:42 PM.

[Deval]

No.

Moving on...

[alone]

I dislike how so many people have said:
"i own 3 Master fighters"
"that would be awesome since 3 of my mains are only expert fighters"
It only comes across that you're out for your own, which isn't always bad, just it won't do the idea any help.
If you like the idea, support it with positive feed back, rather than how it'll make you better.

Everything Deval has said makes sense, and I'm sure his future posts will reflect my views also.

[Zapatak]

So many people? actually i believe i'm the only person that said it in this post there buddy. And i'm pretty sure you could get a supportive-type ansawer out of that. I'm saying i get killed by everything else i come across, and to tell the truth, this wouldn't do a ton of help to me......It would make things more interesting is all. And YES, if you really couldn't find my support in it, i am for it. Critic

[Rappy_Ninja]

this idea should be put in o.O

[Windwalker]

very good idea

wuold also give the fighters someting of a one up against zerkers too which is needed

[stalker]

i train mostly thieves and i actually do like the idea. 1 thing tho say if a thief assassinates u frm covert thenu wudnt b able to counter it. BUT if he/she is already visible i think you should be able to counter it (i do have a fighter btw lol hes lvl 29) what do u alal think to this idea?

[Shadic]

I really like this idea, and it would prove that fighters are actually masters of weapons, not just some silly soldier.

Edited by Shadic, 07 March 2004 - 01:34 AM.

[green_mantis]

you shouldnt be able to counter any more thatn your total stamina though or this skill would become off balanced

[Deval]

you shouldnt be able to counter any more thatn your total stamina though or this skill would become off balanced

Yes you should, why in that case can someone dodge without stamina? It wouldn't overpower it at all.

[green_mantis]

i just meant that someone shouldnt be able to counter 12 times if they only have 6 stamina

[Deval]

Once again I feel obliged to say:

'You could say the same for dodging'.

[Rappy_Ninja]

you shouldnt be able to counter any more thatn your total stamina though or this skill would become off balanced

then dont attack the same fighter more then 6 times

[Wolfgang]

Good idea.

The idea of it taking stamina kinda defeats the entire purpose.

just my opinion *shrug*

[green_mantis]

i didnt say that it should take stamina; i said that you shouldnt be able to counter more times than you could normally attack.

but yeah i think that i have changed my mind about that